We are still waiting for our new website
design to be ready, so we are updating this one to keep things fresh
Since May many things have happened to KidsLibs!
Anne had to return briefly to the UK to try to find a donor to bring
her back to continue with the work of KLT. Luckily she found AOE
corporation, who donated funds to bring her back to Kenya!
Since returning We have been able to move
Kawangware centre to new premesis, and finally receive delivery
of the rest of the chairs at Laikipia Centre!
and ISK.. Booklab!
BookLab has started between Mathare North
Centre and ISK..they are now on their second book! They have used
S.E. Hintons The Outsiders, and their second book is City of Ember
by Jeanne DePrau. We are still working on getting Rosslyn Academy
on board for a bookclub with Eastleigh centre! Braeburn and Kawangware
centre are still working together on thier bookclub! They have now
completed 3 books: The Outsiders by S.E. Hinton, Burn My Heart by
Beverley Naidoo, and Heaven's Shop by ............ They will recommence
in January 2009.
Also Anne is now working on another 4
centres for next year! These are: Maili Saba, Kasarani (Zimmerman),
Githurai, and Gilgil (our second rural centre!).
Maili Saba- a MYSA centre- . Here
we are mid training of Simon, Douglas and Kennedy! We hope to open
January/ February time next year!
Kasarani. This is being made with
a new CBO called ICEI (International . They are currently finding
a donor to support thier project. They have included a suatainability
plan with their initial proposal
Githurai - a MYSA Centre- is still
moving along . We hope to open this year
Gilgil Centre. This is being made
with the Sonata Trust. They are finding funding to build a new centre
as part of a community centre complex in Gilgil. Half the funding
is available, and we hope that by January the rest of the funding
will be available and building can start. In the meantime we are
trying to find temporary premesis to start organising the stock
and training staff.
Susan Phillips- our newest Trustee!- organised
a fundraiser at her house on Dec 5th. It was a really well organised
and enjoyable couple of hours, although very few people actually
attended. Those who did brought along some books for the centres
too.The children from Mathare North performed their rap (girls rap
group!), and a poem about the post election violence. We had ice
cream, snacks and sodas! Susan created some wonderful boards about
each of the KLT centres, and representatives from each centre came
to the event.
DVD.We are still filming the DVD about
KidsLibs Trust. We are also still trying to find funding for the
editing and production costs... $10-15,000 USD!
KLT UK! Still trying to find a leader
to set up KLT UK as a charity there...
KLT Accountant! We now have an accountant
for the Trust! Neil Jones is doing
our accounting free of charge!
KLT Staff! Patrick is now on KLT staff
for a period of 3 months. If we have funding available we will continue
to be able to pay him. Anne is also now being paid from donated
KLT business cards. Mike Jones from
Colourspace in Nairobi donated business
cards for both Anne and Patrick! They are great quality, and really
help us to sell the Trust! THANK YOU!!! He is also possibly making
us our KLT leaflet!
Donations. We have received substantial
one off donations from AOE Corparation,
and from Paterson Foundation! THANK
YOU!! Without your help KLT could not continue in the work it is
doing. We have also received donations of books from Naheed Popat
and family and Peponi House School.
Smita Pandit and family donated a wonderful desktop computer
which we are now using in our new office at Sara Lee. Sara
Lee have donated us office space, and Bakewell
Rotary Club have sent us the money to purchase a digital
camcorder to record library events and activities!
hope you all remember that I am now living in Sipili, Laikipia West
area North of Nairobi! Have been here since the end of February...
and I love it here!!! I am here to complete Sipili centre (Laikipia).
I can see Mount Kenya every morning, and sometimes can hear elephants
passing in the night!!
all!! Returned from monthly visit to Nairobi yesterday (thursday
28th May), and monthly staff meeting of all centres' staff! Joseph
from Sipili came down on the 3am bus and came to his first meeting!!!
Tanx to Steve, Charles and everyone for looking after him!!
I collected a STACK
of donations whilst I was there!!!
* A box of books from IOM's Lara Quartermain,
* a set of encyclopaedias from Mrs Usha Patel,
* several boxes of books from Akla Shah and her son
* a catalogue drawer unit from ISK and Barbera Jones , elementary
* 6 gallons of exterior paint from BASCO Paints and Mr Mital
Shah for our mural in Sipili!
On June 4th EABS Bank and Mercantile Insurance are donating
50,000/- to KidsLibs Trust!!!! I am unable to attend, so Steven
from Mathare North and his wife Peggy will be receiving the cheque
on behalf of KidsLibs Trust!! The function is at the Grand Regency
Hotel in Nairobi. Thank you so much EABS and Mercantile for your
Eastleigh School in the UK is donating money to Eastleigh
library!!! We dont know how much, but we know it is coming, and
it will be spent of creating an Africa Collection
The catalogue drawers are now filled and in Sipili library! The
paint is also delivered, and the boxes of books safely stowed at
Sara Lee in my office. My poor little car did struggle with the
weight of it all, as I was also carrying my German Shepherd dog!!
I REALLY need a laminator donating guys. I was unable to laminate
the signs for the new library due to the expanse of getting them
done commercially.... CAN ANYONE HELP???
THANK YOU THANK
YOU THANK YOU!!!
Hey! Have I mentioned new website address???? is:- KidsLibsTrust.org.
Will soon have a new look too, as a friend (Susan Phillips) and
her friend in USA (Jeremy) are re designing it!!! Watch the site
space!!! It really needs updating, but cant do much till re design
in place! We do however all have new E mail addresses you can contact
us on! I am firstname.lastname@example.org.
You can also use email@example.com, or firstname.lastname@example.org.
Each individual centre will have its own kidslibstrust.org address
Latterday Saints Church Wheelchairs
3 beautiful brand spanking new wheelchairs are now located in Kawangware
centre (1) and in Sipili Centre (2)! We have another three to receive
from LDSC, which will be located in Githurai centre (2) Eastleigh
centre (1) and another centre in the future.. possibley Gilgil.
THIS IS OUR BEST YET!!!
Sipili Centre is nearly complete!! Joseph and I are finishing cataloguing
the last of the Adults non fiction stock. The children's drama group
(age 7 - 14 years) has written and rehearsed a short play for our
opening on the 7th June, and a local writer has written a poem about
our library, which one of the children will perform at the opening!
More and more people are now popping thier heads around our door
to see what we are doing, and to ask for information on opening
etc. John, a local artist, has designed a wonderful mural to paint
on the whole side to the library building! It will depict Mount
Kenya, the rural environment, and the peoples of the area, as well
as the library and the activities we plan to do... Will post a piccie
when I have one!!!
Kawangware and Braeburn bookclub has had their second meeting! Their
first books was'The Outsiders' by S.E. Hinton. Book number two is
'Burn my Heart' by Beverley Naidoo. I hope to have a report on this
by my next post!! Other clubs will start in September approximately
as schools return form their long break. (Eastleigh and Mathare
North). Still trying to find a partner school for Sipili. UKenya
centre, in Kayole is no longer a KidsLibs Centre so they cannot
participate in this wonderful opportunity.
Susan Phillips has also started a Penpals club with Kawangware cente
intitially. The children from Kawangware are writing to children
of their age in the USA! Will see how this develops before introducing
at other centres!!
Anne- LEAVING KENYA...IMPORTANT INFO!!!
Anne is returning to UK to find donors on
June 9th (arrive 10th) to support and expand KidsLIbs Trust. She
also hopes to set up a KidsLibs Trust bank account in the UK, and
register KidsLibs Trust as a UK charity. If she finds a donor quickly
she hope to be back in Kenya by August! She is already booked
to give talks to three branches of Rotary Club in the UK, and hopes
to visit any foundations, businesses etc who may be interested in
financing KidsLibs Trust. Whilst she is away Steven Irungu from
Mathare North Centre will chair our monthly meetings, and Patrick
Ngabia (Anne's P.A) will keep Anne informed as to developments in
Kenya!! He will also collect donations, etc.
Well, a very sad
start to the new Year here in Kenya. Luckily all our centres have
survived, although Charles and Stephan from Mathare North lost everything:
clothes, home, household goods etc. Steven and his wife are now
living in a safe area, although Charles is still living in the library.
Stephan's Mother and sisters are still staying with a friend of
Since we now have
an agreement between the two main political parties in Kenya, we
are all hopeful for a return to peace. Unfortunately many rural
areas are still suffering as a result of tribalism.. or in the name
of tribalism. Crops and property are being burnt or destroyed near
Sipili (our Laikipia centre) in a bid to remove 'unwanted' people.
Anne went to visit Mathare
North on 19th January, and was shocked by what she saw. The homes
where she has walked between many times, and taken tea with residents
are no more. They have been flattened and burnt About 900 people
af all tribes have been made homeless. You can feel the tension
and fear still there, as people continue to move out because of
threats to their lives and the lives of their families.
March 2008 UPDATED!
For full report see
Kawangware own page!!!
Laikipia Centre- March
Anne decided due to the costs involved
in travelling to and from Sipili that she would rent a room there,
and stay for a month or three to complete the staff training and
processing of the stock. This reducse both fuel and accommadation
costs dramatically as well as bringing forward the opening of the
Anne went to Sipili week beginning
February 26th. Rent is 6000/- a month. It is rather like camping
in a building- with one of her dogs!. She is staying on a compound
with a lovely family, who is teaching her all the things she needs
to know:- Learning to pasturise fresh milk, and bringing water in
from, using a long drop loo outside are all challenges,no glass
in the windows, DUST, but otherwise most things are available -
fresher and better than in Nairobi!
The work is progressing at a faster
pace, as Anne can monitor work daily. Also educating the library
committee as to their responsibilities is quite a challenge, and
MUCH easier to accomplish while living in Sipili.
I have had several meetings with
the local secondary school teachers (Lariak secondary and Sipili
secondary) reference to the Water Engineering collection donated
by Loughborough university. Also in connection with creating an
Education resource centre in one of their schools, using materials
donated from Canada which are not suitable for library stock (needing
to be used in a classroom setting). Also we have too many Adults
fiction books, so a donation of these will be made to both schools-
if they can show that the school can provide adequate storage for
Enquires have been made also re
starting drama, music and art clubs. There is a lot of interest
in these fields, and 3 people have already started making enquiries
to find local interest.
Anne will have to return to Sipili
after Easter to continue working here to get the centre open ASAP,
for at least another month.
DVD for KidsLibs
Clare Kemp, a professional film
maker has undertaken to make us a DVD to promote the work of The
KidsLibs Trust! This will be a VERY useful tool to send to prospective
donors who know nothing about Africa, or information needs here.Clare
visited Mathare North on Jan 19th, when the drama groups performed
for us with their usual sense of fun! She also attended the opening
of Kawangware, and KidsLibs Trust February meeting.
World Book Day March 9th 2008
Children from Mathare North centre
visited Peponi House Preparatory School for World Book Day. They
spent all day at Peponi school, doing shared reading, participating
in book quizzes, and finally performing drama with the Peponi children
in the afternoon. As a result a sum of money has been collected
to purchase books for the KidsLibs Trust centres! The group performed
two moving poems written by Charles Ajoe(staff at Mathare North
centre) dealing with the effect of the recent post election violence.
They can be seen on the activities page on this site.
We have received donations of books from Priti Shah, Naheed
Popat and family, and Braeburn prep school. We have also received
30 copies of Beverley Naidoo's new book 'Burn My Heart' from Penguin
Books in the UK AND 4 copies of the latest exciting novel by Eoin
Colfer 'AirMan' signed by the author! East African Womens League
donated us a LARGE piece of carpet suitable for our centre
in Sipili Laikipia! It is used, but is quite servicable!! Also KidsLibs
Trust has been donated 6 new wheelchairs by CLDS. (Church
of the Latter Day Saints). These we hope will go: 2 to Githurai,
1 to Eastleigh, 1 to Ukenya centre in Kayole, and 2 to Laikipia
centre! Also copies of Children's Express Magazine for all
of the centres have been donated by Janie Ellerby, art teacher extraordinaire
from ISK! THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH!!
Contract between CBO'S and KidsLibs Trust
All CBO's now have to sign an agreement between themselves and
KidsLibs Trust, ensuring that all donated items remain in the library,
and that all services remain free and open to ALL community members.
We have signed contracts from Laikipia and Kawangware centres, and
are waiting them from Eastleigh and Mathare North (MYSA) and from
UKenya centre in Kayole. Unfortunately no more donations can go
to the centres unless the contract is signed!
After the arrival of Beverley Naidoos Book 'Burn my Heart' (thank
you Penguin Books!) a meeting was held between Braeburn preparatory
school, and KidsLibs Trust. We have decided to pair each KidsLibs
Centre with an international school:
Laikipia centre.....Greensteads or Pembroke school?
Susan Philips has agreed to coordinate the bookclubs on behalf
of KidsLibs Trust. We are currently choosing the books we will use,
hopefully trying to base them loosly on a theme of reconciliation
and tolerance. We envisage 3 boys and 3 girls age approximately
12 years from the KidsLibs Centre, and the same from the international
school will meet monthly at the international school (the international
school to provide transport for the KidsLibs children). We hope
each bookclub will do something a little different from each other:
one may write reviews to publish on the internet, another may decide
to create a drama out of what they have read etc etc.The International
school will purchase the sets of books, which will be kept in the
KidsLibs centre after use, so local kids can borrow them after reading
about them in Children's Express magazine.
Bakewell Rotary Club, UK -Collection
Day for KidsLibs!
On October 20th members of Bakewell
Rotary Club stood out in the freezing cold all day with collection
tins, collecting money for KidsLibs Trust! They raised over £400!
WONDERFUL! . Bakewell Rotary is actually going to donate £800
to KidsLibs in total! This will go towards paying for Anne to get
to Laikipia to do staff training every week for 6 months, also towards
the purchasing of carpeting for Laikipia centre, and if anything
left towards more shelving for Laikipia! THANK YOU!!! THANK YOU!!!
Rotary Club volunteers on the streets of Bakewell, UK
Aussie High Com- and Symbion Architects!!-
'Provincial Library Community Based Self Help Group' Information
Centre/ Library-.The Australian
High Commission approved funds to refurbish and repair the two rooms
at Lariak Primary School in Sipili, Laikipia! The funds have
now been spent. We had to install another two extra windows, which
meant we had to sacrifice our carpeting... so we are now looking
for donors for the carpeting!
Althought the centre/library is
located in the school it is open to all members of the local community.
Indeed the centre is fenced off from the school.
Training was started with the 4
volunteer staff but had to stop due to lack of funds for fuel etc
to get there..., Anne will now be able to recommence as we have
funds available from donors in the USA found by Susam Philips and
from Bakewell Rotary club!
volunteers: Joseph, Martha, Goffry, and Rosemary
Since unpacking the books we have realised that we need more shelving
to house all the stock delivered. We received a large collection
of health and medical books from AMREF and need shelving to house
this too. We may be able to put some of our donated funds towards
further shelving too.
We also are looking for donors
to build us a purpose built Information Centre in Laikipia.
When this happens all items (which can be moved!) donated by Australian
High Commission will be moved to new building.
Symbion archetects here in Nairobi have designed us a
purpose designed Community information Centre. It is exactly what
the community in Laikipia need. They undertook this work free of
charge.... THANK YOU SO MUCH!!! We just need to find a builder and
donors for the 23 million shillings the materials alone will cost!!!
Book review clubs- international!
Beverley Naidoo and her publishers Penguin Books have donated
36 copies of Beverley's new book 'Burn my Heart'. We hope to start
bookclubs in all the centres here in 2008, in conjunction with Penguin
in UK and some UK schools by posting reviews on the internet...
watch this space! Susan Philips, David Griffiths and Ayelen Buraschi
(teachers from USA, UK and Argentina )will be involved with this.
We have a Patron!
Beverley Naidoo., children's author and activist has agreed
to be our patron! Beverley has visited Mathare North, EastLeigh
and the UKenya centres on both of her visits here to Kenya- she
opened Mathare North library in February 2004 with Sir Edward Clay
the -then- Bristish High Commissioner. Have a look at Beverely's
Beverley has also recently published a book set in Kenya called
'Burn My Heart' set in the time of Mau Mau uprising.. I actually
get a mention at the back!!!
Working with Disadvantaged people-
Anne recently had meetings with
both Association for the Physically Disabled Kenya (APDK),
and with the African Braille Centre (ABC).
ABC have suggested making
a corner in Mathare North centre for books in Large Print and for
a special machine which will the enlarge text of any book. If we
can get this machine donated we can do this almost immediately,
as we have some stock in Large print and in Braille.
APDK have suggested that
at our new centre in Githurai we get 2 wheelchairs donated to keep
in the centre. This will enable those community members who need
to use wheelchairs to use our centre. APDK have also decided to
come ot our monthly meetings. We also hope to be invloved in the
National daty for the disabled in December, offering materials,
GOAL is currently looking into expanding
their resource centre in Mukuru slum in Nairobi. Anne has met with
their Irish architect Alice several times! We ar hoping that when
GOAL find the funding that they will become a KidsLibs Centre, so
we can supply stock etc to them. Damaris and Maria from GOAL already
come to our monthly meetings.
Creative Writing Classes at Mathare North: Trading
Fives," an Adventure in Poetry and Art - Susan Philips
Thirteen boys and girls from the Mathare North creative writing
club and 13 girls from the Girls Art and Leadership group at International
School of Kenya worked together over a period of four Saturday afternoons
in September and October to write poems, draw pictures, share their
ideas, and select their best work to be included in a book.
Two handmade copies of the book, including poetry and artwork from
every participant, will be given to the Mathare North and ISK libraries
soon, and the participants hope to celebrate their achievements
with a book launch party. The book is titled "Trading Fives,"
because all of the poems are five lines long, and every piece of
writing and art included represents an exchange of ideas, words,
enthusiasm and support.
The group met at the ISK arts center. The first meeting started
off with an ice-breaking game and setting up pairs of students who
would work together for the rest of the project. Then everyone took
part in a silly drawing exercise called "blind contour drawing."
For this, each child drew a picture of his partner. But the rules
were strict: You could not look down at what you were drawing, and
you could not lift your pen off the paper until you were finished.
The results? If you squint, you might think of Picasso.
Finally, the children interviewed each other and used the results
to write five-line poems called cinquains. Here is one that will
be included in the book, it's by Junior Kimeu, 12, from Mathare
North, about his partner Aliya Chaudhry,10, from ISK.
Reading, painting, writing
Talking to her friends
In subsequent meetings, participants wrote more cinquains, sometimes
working in pairs, and sometimes individually. The poetry topics
were wide-ranging - for instance, one session was devoted to shoes,
boots and sandals - and the organizers provided a whole heap of
sneakers, booties, flip-flops, high heels etc. to get the children's
imaginations going. Before writing, the group talked about how shoes
pick up tell-tale signs of the lives their owners lead - scuff marks,
worn soles, creases. The writers also brainstormed about how it
might feel to be a shoe, and generated a huge list of words having
to do with shoes, walking, running, etc.
The final session was a mad rush, as the pairs picked their favorite
poems and then set about making plates of their illustrations in
order to produce two identical copies of the art for the handmade
books. Two extra helpers, printmaker Chris kinanjui and Angela Wangeru
gave invaluable support as the children figured out the printmaking
process and rushed to complete two good prints before it was time
It was great to see the children work together and gain confidence
in their writing and their art. And it would not have been possible
without help from four ISK high school students, Laura Hutchinson,
Yasmin Azli, Manon Verchot and Bryonny Bidder, who helped set up
for each session and then circulated around the room, providing
encouragement and the occasional nudge.
Now, it is up to the organizers - Susan Phillips, who has been
working with the Mathare North creative writing group, and Jane
Elleby, an art teacher at ISK who leads the Girls Art and Leadership
group - to sit down with the high school helpers and put the books
together in their final form.
KidsLibs Trust UK.
Nicci Crowther, a TV and film producer
from the UK came to visit in February. Nicci is with the Akili Trust,
who have set up a small library in Malindi area. Nicci has returned
to UK and has started work to make KidsLibs into a charity in the
UK!!! I have found Trustees, but have yet to find someone willing
to be the coordinator.. who will organise meetings etc... any volunterrs???
Contact Anne please!. We will then be able to raise funds in UK
for The KidsLibs Trust here.
Muthaiga Rotary Club and Friends!
Our books from Canada arrived safely!!!
Muthaiga Rotary worked closely with Sheri Harper inToronto to get
these delivered to Kenya.. Exciting stuff!!! These books have been
divided between two centres (September 2007). We have decided to
not unpack them in Nairobi, but to transport them directly to Sipili
and unpack them there. They arrived in Sipili on September 22nd.
Thanks to Safaricom Foundation!
Foundation are now sponsoring our new Information Centre
in Kawangware slum in Nairobi!!! They are sponsoring us for
a period of two years, including paying for full refurbishment of
the building, rent, electricity, water, and for one full time member
of staff, plus 2 volunteers over the two year period!!! The work
has started on this centre! The carpet is in, and the books unpacked
and on the shelves! Cataloguing etc is well under way. We hope to
Safaricom Foundation have also donated KidsLibs
with 10 wind up/ solar powered radios! Three of these are
going up to Laikipia to be used to listen to educational and health
programmes (2 are already in place) three have gone to Kawangware
area and are already being used in local schools and clinics, the
remaining 4 are going to UKenya library, Kenya Breast Health Programme
(for use in conjunction with their new mobile mamography unit),
Tell Tale to educate their youth and the youth they educate through
their dramas, and the fourth going to GOAL resource centre in Mukuru.
The groups have to report back on the use made of their radios over
the initial 6 month period.
KidsLibs Monthly Meetings-
September We had some
basic first aid training from Kenya Red Cross. This took
place after our regular morning meeting.
October- we were due
to have the ABC (African Braille Centre) to talk but they had to
November- we had ABC(
African Braille Centre) who talked about services they offer to
the blind and partially sighted. They have many contcts wit NGO's
and donor organisations, and can keep us informed about eye clinics
nationwide, and provide materials for clients. They have a register
of blind and partially sighted in most regions. As we try to serve
all community members it is helpful for us to know what services
to this group our centres need ot provide.
2007 New Information Centre/
Githurai. Anne visited
Githurai - a MYSA library- in August. The building is almost complete.
Just the floor and ceilings to go in inside! The plans for furniture
have now been submitted by MYSA to their donor in Holland.
Kawangware- a WFF Information
Centre/ Library-. Safaricom Foundation are
now sponsoring our new Information Centre in Kawangware slum in
Nairobi!!! They are sponsoring us for a period of two years, including
paying for full refurbishment of the building, rent, electricity,
water, and for one full time member of staff, plus 2 volunteers
over the two year period!!! The work has started on this centre!
The carpet is in, and the books unpacked and on the shelves! Cataloguing
is well under way. We hope to open January
Maile Saba- a MYSA library.
MYSA is still working on making the building suitable for library
Laikipia- (see above!)
- This centre wouldl be our second rural centre. We are again
in negotiation with community members in Gilgil re opening a centre
there. Anne had a meeting on November 13th with some members of
the committee, but is not very hopeful that this centre will actually
happen, due to the membership and attitide of some members of the
library committee... Watch this space!
Rotary Club, UK. is
donating £800 after their street collection day in October!
EABS Bank has donated
50,000/- towards KidsLibs Trust running costs
have donated 70,000/- towards the running costs of KidsLibs Trust!
Eunice Muthoni donated the use of a truck to transport 4
tonnes of books from Nairobi to Sipili in Laikipia.
AMREF has donated over 500 medical books from their medical
library! Most of these will be going to the centre in Laikipia.
AFK. Brain Ball brought over a donated laptop from AFK!!
He also donated- and put on - a heap of new software, and donated
himself a hard drive, a memory stick, USB port adaptor and other
items! Thank you!! It will be great to have a work laptop again!!!
Donna Myers, Janis Richter, and Grier and Barbars Horner have also
donated USD from the USA!!! Susan Philips has recruited their assistance
in this. MANY THANKS guys!!!! In October Susan also recruited further
donors (Timothy Hunter, Stephan Goguen, Kathleen Fiorillo, Carol
S. Ryder, and Cecilia M. Garcia) whose donations arrived during
November. This enabled Anne to go to Laikipia to continue the training
See the donor page for full listing.
I hope KidsLibs managed to inspire all our visitors
in their work! Many thanks to Stephan and Charles at Mathare North
library who always make visitors so welcome!
Brain Ball- a computer retiree from Microsoft
(now living in France!) visited in September/ October. He found
out about KidsLibs from AFK, and is helping to advise us on library
computer systems, website design,etc. Brain also brought over the
donated laptop computer from AFK. He as completely rehalled it,
adding memory, USB points, Wireless connections (x3!) and a LOAD
of new software!
School fee payment offers!-
unfortunately through various misunderstandings
this has not been possible.
We have some new pages on our website!
'Trustees' (under 'People' tab) tells you who
our trustees are, and why they wanted to become trustees.
'Wishlist' page tells you all what we need
and for where and why!!!!